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Max
05-10-10, 18:36 PM
Can they be retro fitted or do they have to come from the factory with them on?

Thanks Max

meggark
05-10-10, 18:48 PM
Are you meaning winglets? If so fitting them an aircraft which wasn't designed for them will be a major mod, and definately not worth the trouble.

Max
05-10-10, 19:08 PM
I mean for the C42 - as some do come with the wing tips and others do not, I just wanted to know whether they can be retro fitted.

spear
05-10-10, 20:05 PM
Interesting, I once asked P&M Aviation if I could temporarily use a GT-450 winglet on my QuikR (one of mine was in for repair under warranty), the answer was absolutely not!

My understanding is that winglets are very specific to the design of a particular wing, and as such cannot be retro fitted/interchanged etc.

Of course this may only apply to weightshift/flexwing Aircraft, but I'm sure it will be the same for fixed wing.

Katie
05-10-10, 22:39 PM
Ello Max, I dont know the legalities, but ive flown c42s with and without the plastic wingtip (its not really a winglet, it has a slight upturn) and In all honestly think they do bugger all Seeing as how both versions exist on the UK register and must have been passed as ok, then I cant for the life of me think why you couldnt retro-fit them

I don't think they could be retrofitted, even it they could it would mean a lot of messing about with the wing which would never be worth it, plus the wings may needed re-skinning (3000 each!)
I've flown the fancy wing tip version and there was zero performance difference which I found surprising and a bit disappointing but at least I know that I not missing out on anything :)

spear
06-10-10, 00:09 AM
I’m no expert, but I think the main advantage of Winglets is to reduce drag (at the tips) and thus improve fuel efficiency/lift. Other Winglets (as in my case) also provide increased stability at low speed.

The C42 winglets will undoubtedly offer some tangible benefit over and above the standard wing (this I’m certain of), but is it worth the extra cost?

Katie
06-10-10, 10:17 AM
Winglets encourage the vortices created by the circulation around the wing to be shed at the wingtips instead of along the rest of the wing span, this produces more lift for the size of the wing (I think). I would guess they are more useful on microlights for flex wings rather than fixed wing because of the wing shape. More info (much more info!) here: http://www.av8n.com/how/htm/airfoils.html#sec-airfoils



The C42 winglets will undoubtedly offer some tangible benefit over and above the standard wing (this I’m certain of), but is it worth the extra cost?

I'm sure there is some aerodynamic benefit, but I suspect the main tangible benefit is to Ikarus; It must be easier to sell a 50,000 aircraft if it doesn't have what looks like scaffolding poles sticking out of the ends of the wings :)

Bill Scott
28-11-10, 23:13 PM
Katie, I think you're spot-on there.
The X-air Hawk has rather smart wingtips which have improved the look of the aircraft greatly. However, I can also confirm that the handling has improved also with the winglets and reduced span.
Interstingly, I was told today by somebody wearing a Flylight shirt that the ones on the Nynja are purely cosmetic and don't seem to make any difference to handling.
The ones on the latest Jabiru UL are reputed to improve the effectiveness of the rather small ailerons quite considerably.

Carl Bayliss
29-11-10, 10:08 AM
The winglets/tips make quite a difference on the C42, having flown a fair few hours in both types. The benefit is the change in stall speed with them fitted and better control response at slower speeds. I can comfortably bring the C42 with the tips fitted much slower (way below the yellow triangle) than the one without. It also improves efficiency of the wing, meaning less fuel burn and better overall performance.

There are a fair few microlights with tips....look at the Shadow for example....and that was developed in the 80's!

Katie
29-11-10, 10:42 AM
The winglets/tips make quite a difference on the C42, having flown a fair few hours in both types. The benefit is the change in stall speed with them fitted and better control response at slower speeds. I can comfortably bring the C42 with the tips fitted much slower (way below the yellow triangle) than the one without. It also improves efficiency of the wing, meaning less fuel burn and better overall performance.


That explains why I didn't noticed any difference as I didn't land the fancy wing tip version, the guy I was flying with is based at a short strip with trees at either end, somewhere I would not dare land my C42, it would be possible but I don't have the nerve to fly low over trees at below minimum recommended approach speed :eek:

I expected the fancy wingtip version to cruise at a lower rpm for the same airspeed, but it did 70kts at 4200rpm which is exactly the same as my share-o-plane, is the difference only at higher airspeeds? how much lower is the stall speed on the wingtip version?