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  1. #21
    Training Captain Gentreau's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Halibut View Post
    Do you get many engine failures with 4 strokes?
    That depends which 4-strokes and how well they are maintained ......
    The three most useless things in aviation:
    • The air above you.
    • The runway behind you.
    • The fuel in the bowser.


    Rule #1: Always tie your aircraft to the largest heaviest object available. The planet Earth meets these requirements and is readily available in all locations.
    Rule #2: The great thing about twin engined aircraft is, if one engine fails, the other engine always has just enough power to get you to the scene of the crash.

    Semper specto in clara parte vitae.

    .

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    Trev C (13-08-19)


  3. #22
    Co-Pilot Wexfordair's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Halibut View Post
    Do you get many engine failures with 4 strokes?
    Usually just the one.

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    unwind-protect (27-09-19)


  5. #23
    Co-Pilot BobH's Avatar
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    Halibut,

    There's more to go wrong with 4 stroke engines, but overall they tend to be a bit more reliable than 2 strokes (depending on make and model of engine, and maintenance regime).

    I think the main attraction of 4 stroke engines is their economy in comparison with the equivalent power 2 stroke engines, despite the extra weight you have to carry round with 4 strokes, i.e. valve gear, sump oil, etc.

    If someone could come up with a 4 stroke that was as light as the equivalent power 2 stroke they'd be on a winner.

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    MadamBreakneck (13-08-19)


  7. #24
    Captain MadamBreakneck's Avatar
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    I'm with Bob H on this.

    My experience (I'm not an engine guru) is that a failing 4-stroke is more likely to limp home or to a diversion field than a failing 2-stroke which tend to go from sweet to silent in a very short time. Given the engine stops I've had, I reckon that after forced-landing practice, the next best thing is an option to restart in flight (usually electric). As most microlight 4-strokes need an electric start that gives them an advantage over pull start 2-strokes ~ though even then, some of them can be operated in flight - and starter batteries have been known to go flat.

    4-stroke: +less frequent deep maintenance, +generally longer operational life, +more fuel efficient; -heavier, -more capital cost
    2-stroke: +lighter weight, +better power-to-weight ratio, +simpler maintenance, +lower capital cost; -higher fuel consumption, -less warning of impending failure in flight

    But really, you must ask, when comparing, which 2-stroke compared with which 4-stroke in which airframe, and what after-sales-service you can expect if you don't want to be your own mechanic.



    Back to just bimbling in the TST.

    No longer instructing - just pontificating..
    and now a Tai Chi instructor

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    Randombloke (18-08-19)


  9. #25
    Wannabe Pilot Trev C's Avatar
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    Wink

    Come on then
    Don`t be shy
    Name the best ones


  10. #26
    Co-Pilot Antoni's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trev C View Post
    Name the best ones
    Not that simple, as has been said.

    It's down to how correctly an engine is cooled in the aircraft it finds itself in.
    How well it's maintained.
    How much work has gone into looking at how it fails. Rolls Royce Merlins were run at full power until they failed, and then the cause was investigated - expensive.
    The usual suspect's relative benefits are widely discussed here and elsewhere!
    "The single biggest problem in communication is the illusion that it has taken place" - G.B.S.


  11. #27
    Co-Pilot Halibut's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Antoni View Post
    Not that simple, as has been said.

    It's down to how correctly an engine is cooled in the aircraft it finds itself in.
    How well it's maintained.
    How much work has gone into looking at how it fails. Rolls Royce Merlins were run at full power until they failed, and then the cause was investigated - expensive.
    The usual suspect's relative benefits are widely discussed here and elsewhere!
    I wonder what, at the more classic-but-not-too-daring end of microlighting, has the best engine/aircraft combo.
    I know: string. Length etc.
    But...


  12. #28
    Trainee Pilot tomshep's Avatar
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    What do you want to fly? 2k for a MiniMax with a 447 will buy you reliable fun if you aren't too proud to get your hands dirty and your brain in gear. 6 to 10K gets a decent two stroke Rans. Go places. Take a friend along. Don't be in a hurry. Twice that for a reasonable 912 engined machine, say a Skyranger. Now everybody tells you that a 912 is the minimum standard, cheapest to run and most reliable etc. They will also tell you to avoid the Jabiru, HKS and BMW conversions. Most do. The trouble is that four stroke aeroplanes are bloody expensive so buy something under 10k. Nobody will look down their noses at you for buying something affordable that flies. Amongst pilots it is one's ability that matters, not how much you can spend. Snobbery doesn't exist in microlighting. (Envy occasionally!) If you can fly it then you'll be welcomed. If you can afford to fly it then you will do more flying and then you will get better at it. Best type? What you like. Most reliable engine? Anything you don't need to switch back on before you've finished with it.

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    Halibut (29-09-19), unwind-protect (01-10-19)


  14. #29
    Co-Pilot Halibut's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tomshep View Post
    What do you want to fly? 2k for a MiniMax with a 447 will buy you reliable fun if you aren't too proud to get your hands dirty and your brain in gear. 6 to 10K gets a decent two stroke Rans. Go places. Take a friend along. Don't be in a hurry. Twice that for a reasonable 912 engined machine, say a Skyranger. Now everybody tells you that a 912 is the minimum standard, cheapest to run and most reliable etc. They will also tell you to avoid the Jabiru, HKS and BMW conversions. Most do. The trouble is that four stroke aeroplanes are bloody expensive so buy something under 10k. Nobody will look down their noses at you for buying something affordable that flies. Amongst pilots it is one's ability that matters, not how much you can spend. Snobbery doesn't exist in microlighting. (Envy occasionally!) If you can fly it then you'll be welcomed. If you can afford to fly it then you will do more flying and then you will get better at it. Best type? What you like. Most reliable engine? Anything you don't need to switch back on before you've finished with it.
    Brilliant stuff. Thanks.
    What I want is a robust, four-stroke, two-seater that I can take my boys up in (one at a time) and fly occasionally from a field near the house (farmer, neighbours and pheasants willing).
    I don't want to go particularly fast or far - it's about 50 miles to Old Warden from home; Duxford nearer.
    We've gone on holiday by mistake


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